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Croteam on Windows 8 Issues

A post on the Steam Users' Forums from a couple of weeks ago offers a distressing overview of Windows 8 from Croteam (thanks Gamer's Hell), as Alen Ladavac says: "I would very much like to clear this one thing. I think that this is very important as there are 'under the hood' motions related to Windows 8 that are hidden and not well understood even by many developers (yet), and certainly not by most gamers." Saying "Gabe Newel did not overreact," he goes on to describe how "under the hood, the new tiled UI is a means for Microsoft to lock Windows applications into a walled garden, much like the one on iOS." Here's more:

There is this "small detail" that Microsoft is not advertising anywhere, but you can find it dug deep in the developer documentation:

One cannot release a tiled UI application by any other means, but only through Windows Store!

I cannot even begin to stress out just how horrible this idea is! There is no side-loading, except for corporate use inside one company, and that works only on the enterprise edition of Windows 8. Do we all understand what that means? You cannot download an application from the Internet and run it on your computer. You have to get it from Microsoft's store. Even if it is a free app!

If it was just about "being downloaded from Windows store", it would not be a problem. It would be nice to have a common hub to download things from. But to get an app onto that store, it has to be certified by MS. This means bringing the "console experience" onto your desktop. Each app that you will get through the Windows Store will have to adhere to certain requirements imposed by MS. So far, we know that they've banned mature games, like Skyrim, CoD, and Serious Sam.[*] They have forbidden modding. They could very well forbid Open Source if they want. But even if these terms were not there, this is still a certification system. With all of its downsides, including uncertain release dates, rare and late patches, and everything turning out to be more expensive and sucking more.

While, theoretically, desktop applications are exempt from these requirements, it looks more and more like just a foot-in-the-door technique. A large number of developers have expressed their concern with possibility that, probably in Windows 9 or something like that, the ability to get even desktop apps in any other way than through Windows app store may very well be removed. When that happens it will be too late.

I would not invest into supporting the tiled UI apps (which MS now conveniently calls "Windows Store apps" - does that ring a bell?), until MS removes the requirement that they have to be shipped through Windows Store on desktop at least - and thereby remove the requirement of certifying them with MS. Certification is a broken concept and should be abolished.

Now, while in current state Windows 8 do look like they support plain desktop apps seamlessly, the removal of start menu and use of "charms" even on the desktop looks like a pretty blunt attempt to force users to "get used" to the tiled UI. It would be fine by me if it wasn't for the aforementioned certification issue.

So, it is a vicious circle. And not an accidental one. This one was carefully designed to be that way. I say: no thank you, I'll skip on that one.

* (Our footnote, not Alen's): He seems to have missed this story).

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150. Re: Croteam on Windows 8 Issues Nov 19, 2012, 02:03 Muscular Beaver
Fibrocyte wrote on Nov 18, 2012, 11:17:
DukeFNukem wrote on Nov 18, 2012, 11:10:
Zetler wrote on Nov 18, 2012, 10:52:
Right, we should fight Windows 8 because Steam is not a walled garden at all and represent freedom am I right folks? LOL. There's much irony in this.

No one is forcing you to download and use Steam. Windows 8 is stripping away freedom, choice, and power, in more ways than just one.

I don't understand why all the people who love Windows 8 don't just go out and buy themselves a tablet. What makes Windows 8 so much more compelling than Windows 7. "It boots faster". Okay, get a tablet. They boot even faster. "Its more secure". Ok, get a tablet. Its more secure than Windows 7. There is virtually no compelling reason for Windows 7 users to upgrade to Windows 8. Yet there are many reasons to avoid this catastrophe. The stripping away of choice, freedom, flexibility, and power are many of the reasons I will not even look at Windows 8 lest I begin puking.

"It boots faster." You keep saying that. Is that really the only advantage you're aware of? Hell, even in this cess pool of comments there are a few more called out.

All I'm saying in tone down your tantrum until you've educated yourself a little or you're going to end up looking as bad as ASeven.

Its supposed to work with touch devices. Specifically designed for them, they say so proudly. I was excited when I heard that, since I am using a car pc. I tried it and guess what? MINIMUM RESOLUTION 1024x768. Useless for any car pc, unless its in a huge van or truck with like a 10" screen. 800x480 is standard there, because everything bigger doesnt make sense.

Also I was excited about the new UVC standard. Yay, finally no more CPU usage when recording from a webcam that uses an internal encoder.
Tried it. Doesnt work. Black picture as soon as you start recording. Guess some fucking retarded way of DRM.

I also hoped they would learn from their mistakes in Vista and 7, by going back to the sound system in XP, or at least to something that had the features of it, like playing the same source simultaneously over 2 outputs, since so many people complain about it. Nope. Nothing. Still the shitty system they used before. Not even sound quality has improved, you still need to use ASIO or similar if you want proper quality.

I could care less about a little better multi monitor support (actually worse in some aspects) or better virtualization, and you know VERY WELL that most people dont either.
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